I think this is probably much closer to the core of the issue than simply comparing Chinese and American wages. A car isn't just the labor cost of the people doing final assembly. It's batteries, power electronics, semiconductors, motors, castings, software, logistics, suppliers, tooling and the speed at which all of those things can be developed and scaled. That's also why Brazil and Europe are becoming such interesting experiments. Chinese manufacturers are increasingly moving final assembly outside China. In Brazil they're taking over or reusing existing factories and hiring Brazilian workers. In Europe, BYD, Chery, Geely, Dongfeng and Leapmotor are all moving toward some form of localized production. So over the next few years we're going to get much better evidence about this. If their advantage disappears as production localizes, then Chinese labor costs and domestic industrial conditions were doing most of the work. But if much of the advantage survives, then the supplier ecosystem and manufacturing organization you're describing become much harder to ignore. E para o TurkeyBLTSandwich, eu usaria: This is the part of BYD that I think gets overlooked when the discussion becomes only about subsidies and wages. BYD isn't just taking a conventional Western automotive supply chain and paying the assembly workers less. It has built a much more vertically integrated industrial structure around batteries, electronics, powertrains and vehicle production. That doesn't mean the model is automatically superior or that its current advantage will last forever. American manufacturers can reinvest, reorganize supply chains and bring technologies back in-house. But that's exactly why I think competition matters. We're now seeing Chinese manufacturers take that manufacturing model outside China. Brazil is already getting locally produced Chinese vehicles, and Europe is moving rapidly in the same direction. Once those cars are being made by Brazilian or European workers, the wage explanation becomes easier to separate from the manufacturing-system explanation. That's the experiment I'm interested in watching.

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Agreed. And if WTI closes above $105, we could see a run to $120. But there’s significant risk mangue does something stupid like an oil product export ban. 

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No attitude. Only stating the facts. The US is well within their right outright to ban goods from countries who use slave labor and apply reciprocal tariffs to countries we charged no fees after WWII as a temporary accommodation. Everyone thinks temporary means forever. These are rich countries now bitching and moaning like babies that they don’t get to start on third base

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Detroit will definitely e overnight if that happens

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A ban on Chinese cars or not, still won’t make me ever want to buy a Ford or Chevy.

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Reddit mods reading this with their finger on the ban button

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Ya I don’t get how people don’t see the anti data center thing is Chinese/russian propaganda. If we ban data centers here. They will still be built just by China/russia/India etc and we will pay more for the compute and be national security wise screwed. But sure keep buying the propaganda about how bad they are for you and the planet. Make them cleaner/more efficient sure but we need them for our continued economic growth/stability.

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yea but imagine if china ban apple products? do the US have any subsidized products being sold in China? the argument is EV cars collect enormous amount of data via cameras and sensors etc which i think is a fair argument. but, wouldn't it be simple to stop these data from being transmitted to Chinese govt?

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This is fake. Enjoy ban retard

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SMCI up 10% Gone from Double Bottom -> Cup and Handle with nice green candle Ready to rocket another 20-30% by EOY >SMCI P/E: 12.48 DELL P/E: 32.87 >SMCI Forward P/E: 9.36 DELL Forward P/E: 20.04

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